Uncovering the Next Generation's Hall of Fame
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About the 2024 Nominees, Mat r wrote: | |
Chasingwildcat Regarding the pumpkins and oasis. I feel there is one wild card and that's Weezer. Their eternal relevance has been both a both a blessing and a curse. Sure they've been a critical punching bag and developed a goofy meme band reputation but they're also like the only 90s band whose modern output audiences and critics pay serious attention to. They've had a top 10 pop hit, they've had modern alternative radio top 10s than almost everyone, and their super duper influential and industry friendly. They're also on the hall radar. If oasis and pumpkins miss on their first nominations I think Weezer would be next up if the hall is worried about the 90s alt rock backlog. | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 17:24pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, chasingwildcat wrote: | |
What I meant was if both the Pumpkins and Oasis don't become FYNs, then the remaining new wave, indie, and alt snubs basically have very little hope left. | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 15:33pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, chasingwildcat wrote: | |
If Oasis doesn't make it in this year, I think they might try for Smashing Pumpkins. Because they and Oasis are among the few who not only have popular singles in the US (with "1979" reaching number 12, but it's almost top ten, so it could be considered as such), but also high critical acclaim and a lot of resonance with boomers/early Gen X as alternative/indie snubs. If neither Oasis nor the Pumpkins are inducted, it pretty much seals the fate for the remaining indie/alt/new wave artists. Basically, there won't be much hope left for them. It's quite sad. | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 15:29pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, will m wrote: | |
acts that Chris Blackwell helped induct as part of the side category comiites in 02,03,04 and 05 02: Jim Stewart, chet atkins 03: mo ostin, Benny benjamin, floyd Cramer, Steve douglas, 04: jann wenner 05: frank barsalona, seymour stein | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 15:19pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, will m wrote: | |
power, my mistake on Patti, its absurd she had to wait so many nominations. same with the stooges and sabbath. the most have to wait before being nommed again is evidently true with the spinners, they're last nom was 2016 I believe. upon further inspection, Blackwell was on the side category comittees in 02,03, and 04. interesting he was on them but never a main nom com position. | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 15:15pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, power wrote: | |
will M I agree with you on LZ and Springsteen, but Patti Smith definitely had people helping her (I feel she should be FYE). Lenny Kaye and Little Steven is the reason she was nominated again and again. Most other acts do not have this kind of treatment (Rage also had similar treatment because of Tom Morello). If you failed 2-3 times, you were more likely to wait after being nominated again. | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 15:11pm | |
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About Greta Van Fleet, Cp wrote: | |
If they don't get inducted, nobody will. Rhythm section is still under 25 years of age and they have alreayd surpassed a Gazillion of other American bands. | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 15:10pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, will m wrote: | |
power, I agree on the label thing. Ahmet always looked out that his acts like Buffalo Springfield Booker T/MGs and Percy Sledge made it in the hall. Seymour Stein was able to secure nominations for the smiths and replacements. Clive Davis could help Carly Simon, Chicago, and Whitney get the honor. Tony Wilson was never an industry insider, and he was the only man JDNO had (as well as the other factory records guys) had backing them. they always did it in that punk spirit. then when Tony lost all his money and when island records (post Chris Blackwell) came calling, he surrendured all of It immediately cause there was no contracts (lmao he was terrible business man). yes my source for all this is 24 hour party people (its a pity he didn't sign the smiths) Blackwell isn't a rock hall of Fame guy, to my knowledge he's not had any serious involvement with the nom com. his big names are in, Bob Marley and U2. but Free (ahmets atlantic records were the home of bad company as they had distribution over swan song), and the B-52 s are still on the outs. he didn't even have involvement with new order so its not like he'd push them through (the artists I named in the first paragraph are those who I imagine had their cause aided by each executive. Springsteen, led zeppelin, and Patti smith, didn't need label execs to help them in.) | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 15:00pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, power wrote: | |
Will M I found Elton John's comments about New Order. You were right, I will remove Elton John. Elvis Costello's own selection of the top 500 albums does not include Joy Division, which is strange, I tend to think he does not like Joy Division. I just wanted to give an example to illustrate the majority case. You can certainly find exceptions, but most are like this. However, I think what I said is generally correct. You can see many old English boomers have publicly expressed their support for Kate Bush, but it's hard to find their connection with JDNO. This can only mean they are not as fond of JDNO's music, at least not to the extent of Kate Bush. Also, I think Elton did not vote for JDNO in last year and I guess he voted for Crow, Lauper, Willie, Kate and George. | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 14:58pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, will m wrote: | |
power, I wouldnt think Paul mccartney to dismiss JDNO, he's generally got a pretty good ear for most things. he worked with Youth of Killing Joke, and his recent remix album had a song with beck. maybe like mike pinder or hugh Grundy would, but definitely not macca. Elton is definitely a fan of new order tho not that this proves anything, (I cannot find a single thing linking Costello or macca to JDNO) but all 3 macca Elvis and new order appeared in a documentary about a BBC radio broadcaster Janice long. | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 14:47pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, Alec Tess wrote: | |
chasingwildcat I was just being hypothetical lol | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 14:43pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, power wrote: | |
Another factor that hurt JDNO's chances is that they were not under a big music label, whereas Kate Bush and Roxy Music were. So, industry people are definitely more inclined to vote for them rather than JDNO. If JDNO had been under a big music label, they might have achieved greater commercial success and would likely have been nominated earlier. | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 14:02pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, power wrote: | |
xwing1212, Let me give you a detailed analysis of the differences between Roxy Music, Kate Bush, and Joy Division/New Order (JDNO), based on the fact that I am a JDNO fan. They were my most hoped-for inductees last year. For older British inductees, Roxy Music is highly respected. They were big in their era in the UK, and those British boomer inductees would accept Roxy Music. However, JDNO is different; they are entirely younger musicians who haven't received broad recognition from the older generation of British musicians. For instance, during the period JDNO was inducted into the UK Music Hall of Fame, even the drummer from Pink Floyd didn't clap when they went on stage. For artists like Rod Stewart, Elton John, David Gilmour, Deep Purple, Queen, I can definitely foresee them voting for Roxy Music, but I'm pretty sure they would probably be indifferent towards JDNO. The situation is similar with older American rock inductees. You can imagine Gene Simmons, Alice Cooper are very likely to vote for Roxy Music, but they probably haven't had much exposure to JDNO or might not be able to accept their style. The situation with Kate Bush is similar. You can see Kate Bush getting along well with many older British music celebrities like Elton John, Sting, Paul McCartney, Jimmy Page, etc. However, such interactions have never happened with JDNO. It's hard to find instances of their members interacting with older British inductees. They are relatively isolated from the British circle; you hardly see praises from Paul McCartney, Pete Townshend for JDNO, whereas they have high regard for Kate Bush. All of their influence and relationships are primarily with younger musicians and audiences. But a large part of their audience is not rock hall voters. Relying solely on younger British inductees and American alt/new wave inductees' votes is far from enough. | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 13:56pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, xwing1212 wrote: | |
Get that JD/NO slander out of here power. If Roxy Music and Kate Bush can get it, JD/NO can get in. | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 13:42pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, chasingwildcat wrote: | |
Alec Tess Do you really believe in the weighted voting system, that kind of nonsense or BS? Even if we assume such a system exists, it's most likely to be used for ATCQ rather than DMB or others who have been nominated for the second time or only once. It's too early for them; they can be nominated again and try their luck. However, ATCQ is on their third nomination, and even if there were so-called "rigged" voting results, it's most likely to be applied to the artist with the most nominations. | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 13:38pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, Alec Tess wrote: | |
Metallica at least Lars is a big Oasis fan And if they do use a weighted voting system that should help them | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 13:32pm | |
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About Joy Division-New Order, power wrote: | |
After some reflection, I believe Joy Division/New Order might be inducted around 2030 through the Musical Excellence path, or they might never get inducted or even nominated, especially if there's a stronger lean towards pop. I'm pondering who would cast their votes for them. In the UK, their most prominent territory, they lack appeal to the older British voters because of their gloomy and quirky nature. Some younger British inductees might vote for them, but I suspect influential figures like Paul McCartney, members of The Zombies or The Moody Blues, Elvis Costello, and Elton John might have already dismissed JDNO. As for Americans, would white boomers vote for them? Definitely not. They're likely unaware of JDNO. Older Black individuals such as Stevie Wonder or Buddy Guy certainly wouldn't, and while a few younger Black Americans might, the majority, including Jay-Z and Missy Elliott, would likely vote for mainstream and Black artists instead of JDNO. Thus, it seems hardly anyone would vote for them, except for a significant portion of '80s and '90s alternative/new wave inductees. But beyond this group, they virtually have no voter base in America. I'm even pessimistically thinking they might have ended up dead last in last year's final vote. Bands like Maiden and Soundgarden are likely to have a broader voting base. As a fan, I'm concerned they may never be inducted. | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 13:29pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, power wrote: | |
After some reflection, I believe Joy Division/New Order might be inducted around 2030 through the Musical Excellence path, or they might never get inducted or even nominated, especially if there's a stronger lean towards pop. I'm pondering who would cast their votes for them. In the UK, their most prominent territory, they lack appeal to the older British voters because of their gloomy and quirky nature. Some younger British inductees might vote for them, but I suspect influential figures like Paul McCartney, members of The Zombies or The Moody Blues, Elvis Costello, and Elton John might have already dismissed JDNO. As for Americans, would white boomers vote for them? Definitely not. They're likely unaware of JDNO. Older Black individuals such as Stevie Wonder or Buddy Guy certainly wouldn't, and while a few younger Black Americans might, the majority, including Jay-Z and Missy Elliott, would likely vote for mainstream and Black artists instead of JDNO. Thus, it seems hardly anyone would vote for them, except for a significant portion of '80s and '90s alternative/new wave inductees. But beyond this group, they virtually have no voter base in America. I'm even pessimistically thinking they might have ended up dead last in last year's final vote. Bands like Maiden and Soundgarden are likely to have a broader voting base. As a fan, I'm concerned they may never be inducted. | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 13:28pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, power wrote: | |
I'm pessimistic about Sade's prospects because they lack strong connections, and many voters are likely to choose Mariah Carey and Mary J. Blige over Sade. Regarding the UK voter base, a key issue is whether Sade appeals to the older segment of British inductees. Similar to Joy Division/New Order, although they are big names in the UK, old British voters might not connect with or immerse themselves in their music as much. They tend to attract a newer generation of listeners, unlike Oasis, which also won favor with many older British inductees. Thus, I believe the UK voter base would support Oasis, but may not be as supportive of Sade. (And yes, I'm aware that some UK voters definitely won't vote for Oasis, given that some past inductees dislike Oasis, but I'm considering the majority's stance. Just as some might find Bon Jovi cheesy, most past rock inductees still voted for them.) | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 13:15pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, power wrote: | |
My prediction now is almost as same as chasingwildcat Cher Mariah Carey Kool Foreigners Lenny Kravitz Ozzy A Tribe Called Quest Peter Frampton (if 8) Mary J Blige (if 9) Oasis, Sinead, Janes Addiction, EBAR, Sade in this order | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 13:09pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, power wrote: | |
Alec Tess, See the comments by Guest (not guest related to Richie) His previous comment ------- You are right about US hits being a large indicator, but again Radiohead is such an abnormal circumstance that they aren't a good example any of trends. There are little to no artists during their era that have the same critical success and influence, and again if they didn't have that concert the same day they would have been first year inductee (and yes that is important and why Coldplay is held back a year, they will be getting in when nominated but they wouldn't make it this year for that reason) Nine Inch Nails and Rage are better examples of known bands with critical success and influence but not really any mega US radio hits and the common route to induction. Kate Bush is the example how US radio hits are unfortunately what gets people to vote, and Kraftwerk is what happens when they have none and even the most influence doesn't matter. Also why Devo and Iron Maiden should get at least 5 shots for main route - that's the time trend with these slightly more niche artists and arguably Rage is a trickier band to get in but they did it ----------- So I think DMB could get in after more tries. Unfortunately, in two nominations, DMB compete with a ton of classic rock and guitar rock and contemporary rock acts, which is not good for DMB. Most voters would definitely vote for Doobie Brothers or Foreigner over DMB. DMB could have better luck if this band is nominated with less white rock acts. | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 13:02pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, chasingwildcat wrote: | |
My guess now includes CHER, MARIAH CAREY, KOOL AND THE GANG, FOREIGNER, LENNY KRAVITZ, OZZY, and A Tribe Called Quest. As for that fantasist guest, regardless of what's said, Richie will still believe in things so unbelievable that not even a baby would trust them. However, seeing opinions related to the guest really makes me very irritable. | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 12:55pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, richie wrote: | |
Alec Tess, The only way DMB gets in this year is that if the committee uses a weighted voting system again this year just like last year and they get in via through weighted voting by the committee. rather than by the actual voters. Just like last year when RATM and Kate Bush got in through weighted voting by the committee last year. rather than by the actual voters. What do you think?. | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 12:21pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, AlecTess wrote: | |
I know people hate this but it's just the way it is I wonder if Dave Matthews Band wins the fan vote but falls short in the actual voting they will make it up by putting DMB through the Muscial Excellence route? | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 12:06pm | |
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About Rock Hall Projected, Ian wrote: | |
Here's my top 10 picks: 1. Dionne Warwick 2. Snoop Dogg 3. The Village People 4. Boston 5. They Might Be Giants 6. Phil Collins 7. Sinead O'Connor 8. The Fugees/Lauryn Hill 9. Ministry 10. Cliff Richards & The Shadows Runners-Ups: Usher, Tracy Chapman, Will Smith | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 08:47am | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, Timothy Pernell wrote: | |
John R.C., Thanks. Don't know why FRL hasn't updated those yet. | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 01:56am | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, John R.C. wrote: | |
Timothy Pernell That number isn't accurate since the ballot tracker hasn't logged in the Patreon exclusive episodes. This is the real number of where things stand: 15 for Kool & The Gang 14 for A Tribe Called Quest 12 for Sinead O'Conner 11 for Eric B & Rakim 10 for Mary J. Blige 10 for Oasis 6 for Jane's Addiction 6 for Ozzy Osborne 6 for Mariah Carey 6 for Sade 6 for Cher 5 for Frampton 5 for Sade 4 for Foreigner 4 for Lenny Kravitz 1 for DMB | |
Thursday, 03/28/2024 @ 01:53am | |
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About Stray Cats, Jay wrote: | |
Rockabilly gets overlooked, its unfortunate as the musicians are better than many inducted. The Blasters and Stray Cats are worthy of the honor. | |
Wednesday, 03/27/2024 @ 21:48pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, Ron Jenkins wrote: | |
Alright guys, taking a few weeks off from the site. See ya between when voting ends and before the inductee announcement. | |
Wednesday, 03/27/2024 @ 18:10pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, Alec Tess wrote: | |
Not saying this is the reason they weren't voted in last time around but there are people in the reason who can't stand Jack White | |
Wednesday, 03/27/2024 @ 18:06pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, Ron Jenkins wrote: | |
Mat R, Well only time would tell. | |
Wednesday, 03/27/2024 @ 17:34pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, Jennifer wrote: | |
Timothy, I hope we get more inductees too since there are lots on this ballot that are very worthy and many that should have been inducted long ago. :) | |
Wednesday, 03/27/2024 @ 17:01pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, Timothy Pernell wrote: | |
Oops forgot about Oasis: 9 on the ballot tracker | |
Wednesday, 03/27/2024 @ 16:50pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, Timothy Pernell wrote: | |
Ballot tracker: Those who are doing well (6-10) on it so far: K&TG - 10 ATCQ - 9 Sinead - 8 MJB - 6 EBAR - 6 Ozzy - 6 Jane's - 6 Those midway (5): Cher - 5 Peter Frampton - 5 Those doing more poorly (1-4): Mariah - 4 Foreigner - 4 Lenny - 3 Sade - 3 Dave Matthews Band - 1 | |
Wednesday, 03/27/2024 @ 16:47pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, Timothy Pernell wrote: | |
Jennifer, LOL I just noticed I didn't. :D Error on my part... I keep thinking we may have more inductees. Maybe these were my "should be" lists or something. UGH LOL | |
Wednesday, 03/27/2024 @ 16:41pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, Timothy Pernell wrote: | |
I actually put Oasis in my "should be inducted" list. Don't get why the White Stripes were denied. | |
Wednesday, 03/27/2024 @ 16:39pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, Jennifer wrote: | |
Timothy Pernell, You said that you thought Foreigner was a lock but did not include them in any of your sample possible scenarios. What's up with that? | |
Wednesday, 03/27/2024 @ 16:39pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, Mat r wrote: | |
Ron Jenkins Sure but how and how long are going to be the issue. If white stripes, beck, and Smiths are taking 2-5 nomination there's no real path for modest mouse or yeah yeah yeahs, if you're using side categories for sonic youth and pavement then how long is it gonna take for my bloody valentine or Liz Phair. Like metal and rap had stars you could get in quick to avoid these issues, indie seemingly doesn't have a one and done artists and really big acts (the Smiths) need at least 3 nominations. The stadium acts and festival headliners (white stripes and beck) need multiples. if oasis can't get over the hump on a nomination, the genre is going to be the slowest train possible | |
Wednesday, 03/27/2024 @ 14:12pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, Ron Jenkins wrote: | |
I really do think indie rock will have more representation at the Hall & hopefully acts including Pixies, Sonic Youth, The Replacements, The White Stripes, Beck & The Smiths would get their due before this decade comes to a close as they're among those artists who are pretty much a big deal to today's indie scene. I mean if The Velvet Underground who are considered as leaders/figures of the whole "alternative music" scene, movement & culture could get inducted so can them as well. | |
Wednesday, 03/27/2024 @ 13:35pm | |
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About the 2024 Nominees, Alec Tess wrote: | |
Dave Ghrol is a big Oasis fan and had Liam Gallagher preformat the Taylor Hawkins tribute show | |
Wednesday, 03/27/2024 @ 12:59pm | |
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